God, I wish we had a concept like that
The only reason their law was upheld is because Parliament voted against their president’s call for martial law.
The same system exists in the US. Unfortunately, we voted as a nation to fill Congress with Trump loyalists.
There’s no point in having laws if no one will hold leaders accountable to them.
It’s a bit more complicated than that. The people’s power party has supported Yoon much like the Republicans have supported trump, this was just the straw that broke the camels back.
If the parliament didn’t immediately deal with the situation, there would have been a massive riot. Koreans have a pretty long history of rioting against the government, and even the extremist among the right wing politicians didn’t want to catch that smoke.
The biggest difference between the US and Korea is that the US police state is filled with conservatives who yearn to do violence against their fellow citizens. While the Korean police state is mostly made of everyday normal people who are just doing their mandatory service.
There was a moment last night where the military could have stepped in and enforced the president’s will, but chose not to. I think if it had been America, the woman who grabbed a soldier’s rifle pointed at her head and scolded the dude, would have been killed or at very least beaten severely.
There was a moment last night where the military could have stepped in and enforced the president’s will, but chose not to
Umm, why are we whitewashing the military’s role in this? Let’s not forget that the military tried to stop the vote of the National Assembly to end martial law. They had to defend the Assembly using fire extinguishers and couch barricades to stop the military breaking in. And that the military continued enforcing the martial law provisions everywhere other than the Assembly even after the National Assembly had voted unanimously to end it, not standing down until 3 hours later when President Yoon declared it over.
Constitutionally I have no idea what’s up. Whether the initial declaration was lawful, whether the Assembly’s motion to end it had legal effect, whether the President’s word was needed to end it. But at the very least from an outsider perspective, it certainly looks like the military was attempting to enforce the President’s will and was taking advantage of the opportunity to be as authoritarian as it could.
Umm, why are we whitewashing the military’s role in this?
Not really trying to “whitewash” the military. I was just pointing out the difference between the average cop in America and the average service member in Korea.
The military is definitely part of the police state and will obviously do their jobs, especially the command structure. However, there is a big difference between the socially acceptable use of state violence between the two countries.
President’s word was needed to end it. But at the very least from an outsider perspective, it certainly looks like the military was attempting to enforce the President’s will and
Much like America the president is the commander and chief of the military, and thus the military must follow lawful orders.
was taking advantage of the opportunity to be as authoritarian as it could.
I think that’s a bit of an over exaggeration considering there wasn’t a mass casualty event or even real violence. Which is definitely an improvement considering South Korea was a highly violent military dictatorship within my own lifetime.
Okay but you also need to acknowledge they rolled out with all of their gear. If they truly supported this then some staffer with a fire extinguisher would not have stopped them. This has all the energy of malicious compliance.
This has all the energy of malicious compliance.
Strongly disagree. I see no evidence to believe that’s what it is.
Just because the military was engaged, doesn’t mean that they were told it’s no holds barred. Even riot police suppressing violent protests don’t typically just turn a machine gun on the protestors. They would have had rules of engagement that prevented them from escalating too far. And possibly, yes, a personal reticence on the part of the soldiers directly involved in it and their immediate superiors to escalate in a way that would cause irreparable harm, but even that is categorically different from “malicious compliance” where the goal is to only do the bare minimum that would not get them in trouble for disobeying orders. Instead it’s more like do the most they think they can without causing a huge scandal about their own actions.
You have a contradiction. You admit they may have had an extremely restrictive ROE, but ignore what that means about military buy in for their orders. That’s something the officers would impose to maliciously comply with the president’s orders. “The President has ordered you to occupy Parliament and secure the building from ministers and staff. Your commander requires that you do this without hurting anyone, the most you may do is to give verbal commands.”
No matter which way you cut it, if they had believed in it those staffers would be dead or in detainment and the legislators wouldn’t have made it within a mile of the place.
That’s something the officers would impose to maliciously comply with the president’s orders
Not necessarily. I think it’s quite unreasonable to interpret it any other way than that the President presumably wouldn’t want Koreans mass shooting Koreans, especially elected politicians. The level of force they used is pretty much what I would expect of normal compliance with the orders and their presumed spirit, given what seems to be a lack of detail.
Interesting. I need to learn more about South Korea’s governmental structure. Thank you for the insight. Your description of the difference in military response is on the money as well.
Reminds me of this one:
That leaves out how public opinion changed after motive was known.
The assassination brought the many social issues with the Unification Church under the spotlight again, as well as tumbled the approval of the ruling party. Under the public pressure, the responsible ministry decided to file a dissolution order against the UC with the Tokyo District Court on 13 October 2023, after nearly a year of investigation of wrongdoings
Japanese people cosplaying Yamagami’s appearance during Abe’s assassination were spotted at events like the rally against Abe’s state funeral. These cosplayers held cardboard signs displaying the leaders they were against: Abe, Ali Khamenei, Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping
Right now there are a bunch of supreme cout justices who have lied to the public and reversed some laws, stripping away the rights of vulnerable demographics, resulting not just in a body count, but some particularly ghastly preventable deaths.
The story goes on with Texas changing its investigation and reporting policies so that these gruesome deaths can go without public scrutiny or outcry.
I am not a militant activist, and in most cases do not condone assassination, including the attempt on Trump. But if the lifetime appointments of supreme court justices were to suddenly become a liability, say if any of the FedSoc jurists were shot at, I would certainly enjoy the poetry.
It’s actually Leonard Leo and his dark money benefactors that deserve a proper Disney eaten-by-hyenas demise, and so much damage has been done that the imbalance of justice will be felt for centuries.
So even for peaceniks like me, there are exceptions to civilized process.
The rule of law?
What’s that? Can you explain to us Americans?
Maybe after it arrives in merry old England.
Tea-ché
It seems like the rest of the party didn’t have faith in him. He jumped the gun for personal reasons, while it would have cost the judiciary and politicians more than it would benefit.
This is kinda what happened when Trump lost the 2020 election. AG Bill Barr was probably down with a dictatorship, but he also knew that Trump wasn’t gonna pull it off then. If Trump tried to overturn that election, the military would have stopped him and the public perception would sour. By holding Trump back from a more radical conflict that might actually bar him from running again, Trump was able to come back for the same reasons that he won in 2016.
If President Moon gets removed, the opposition party might come into greater conflict with Trump because they’re less enthusiastic about licking America’s boot. Trump will likely stop protecting them against North Korea unless they agree to unreasonable demands, as he tries to avoid such defense obligations. He might leave no matter what, but Moon will probably return to power anyways in 2026 on a platform of getting support from America.
He needs to be barred from holding office, or South Korea will be the next liberal democracy to fail from inside.
Its sad when the most cyberpunk country has actual law and order.
In all the cyberpunk I’ve read/seen the state is usually quite weak, and that’s a pretty important aspect. Martial law is not compatible with a weak state. That’s a different type of dystopia
Just to be clear, Skeet is not what you think it means. https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/skeet/
It absolutely does, https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/skeet-bluesky-slang
So basically blue sky is actually twitter 2.0, not shocked.
Because of a humourous term for posts? Wha?
It wasn’t broken before Elon
So why not build it back as it was 🤷♂️
It was pretty broken before Elon too, Elon just sprayed hot diarrhea all over its flailing corpse
Are you insane? Yes the fuck it was
